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Leadership and Lack of It

AndersonDawgAndersonDawg Posts: 802 ✭✭✭✭✭ Graduate

Fifty years ago my sorry butt was halfway through a tour in Vietnam. I saw firsthand excellent, average and poor leaders. Football coaches fall into the same mold. Examples of leaders I would “follow into battle” are Kirby Smart, Mark Richt, Vince Dooley and Erk Russell. They would put the mission and the welfare of their troops first. Examples of leaders I would not want to “follow into battle” are Urban Meyer, Jimbo Fisher and Dan Mullen. Urban and Jimbo would put themselves above the safety of their troops, while Dan would lead you unwittingly into an ambush.

I would not let my child go to a school where unethical people like Urban and Jimbo were in charge nor where a nitwit like Dan was in charge. I hope the parents of our prospective athletes consider this when helping their children make their decisions.

I’m off my soapbox now.

Comments

  • DvilleDawgDvilleDawg Posts: 499 ✭✭✭✭✭ Graduate

    It's a good soapbox and I totally agree.

  • greshamdiscogreshamdisco Posts: 1,613 ✭✭✭✭✭ Graduate

    As we enter the summer months, leaders on our team - those molded by our staff - should emerge. It’s part of being a leader: training younger leaders. Who do you see stepping forward? I have no inside knowledge, so any name would be a guess for me.

  • dawgnmsdawgnms Posts: 1,793 mod
    edited May 1

    Would of definitely followed them when I was in the Mekong @AndersonDawg great post....

  • KaseyKasey Posts: 8,642 mod

    That clip that came out with Kirby ready to go eat I was ready to strap on a hat and run some routes

  • RPMdawgRPMdawg Posts: 2,206 ✭✭✭✭✭ Graduate

    We are lacking good leaders in an area beyond football. I'll leave it at that.

    Hope some team leadership emerges this year like 2017. Its important for us to get to where we want to be at year's end

  • BankwalkerBankwalker Posts: 3,436 ✭✭✭✭✭ Graduate
    edited May 2

    I disagree on your examples of poor leadership. It is yet to be determined if Dan Mullen is a good or bad leader. He is definitely a goofball, but that might be okay in the end. Will his players get in trouble? Will they go on to become productive citizens? What impact will he have on his player’s lives? Football does involve some off the field gamesmanship, and that’s what we are getting from cousin eddie toward UGA. It’s our loyalty to Georgia that makes someone view him as a bad leader, but he was successful at Miss St and I don’t recall many problems in their program while he was there. Or maybe I’ve missed something Has he sone more than just upset Georgia fans?

    Some people drink alcohol excessively and do drugs even though they know doing so is bad for their health. Maybe Urban Meyer has jumped in and out of jobs “for health reasons” because the stress of coaching really does break him down, but he loves coaching and can’t help thinking “I can control this. It will be different this time.”

    Good leaders do make mistakes, and sometimes miss a problem that then spirals out of control. The optics were bad, but I think that’s what happened with his assistant coach. The guy wasn’t an important enough contributor to Meyer’s program for him to “protect” him the way it appeared from the outside looking in. I also don’t think he thought Aaron Hernandez was a homocidal maniac. That said, you don’t accomplish the things that Urban Meyer has accomplished if you aren’t one helluva great leader.

    Every leader has their share of bad apples when they have as many people following them as these coaches.

    When I see our players getting arrested it makes me question Kirby’s leadership.

  • KaseyKasey Posts: 8,642 mod

    Agree on Mullen.

    Disagree strongly on Urban. His past shows how little character he really has

  • WCDawgWCDawg Posts: 14,627 ✭✭✭✭✭ Graduate
    edited May 2

    Bama never seems to lack leadership from year to year, care to speculate why that is ?

    Leadership begins at the top. I think programs that end up hoping leadership will emerge among the current roster is lacking something from it's HC. I see great signs from Kirby but does he have what it takes to build a perennial power, or will he be reliant on player/leaders from year to year ?

    I think he has staying power, but only time can really answer that question.

  • CTDawgCTDawg Posts: 896 ✭✭✭✭✭ Graduate

    I don't question Kirby's ability to lead the program. He can't be responsible for every kid on his team every waking moment; even parents can't do that. Since the last arrests (Cox and Beal?), have you heard anything bad coming out of Athens in regards to players? Mistakes were made, and it seems they were dealt with. Same thing with the recruiting director; mistakes were made, and appropriate action was taken.

    I do somewhat disagree about Mullen being a bad leader, he's just trying to stir the pot. He comes across as a fool, but like you said, MSU was run fairly well as a program considering their limited resources compared to the big boys in the SEC. If he keeps losing and keeps talking, I might change my stance on that.

  • BankwalkerBankwalker Posts: 3,436 ✭✭✭✭✭ Graduate

    That’s a different issue. You don’t generally get elected POTUS if you aren’t able to lead a large army of people (Dubyah being the exception), but only someone of blind loyalty would say Bill Clinton has good character. You can also be a good leader and have lots of people disagree with your decisions.

  • KaseyKasey Posts: 8,642 mod

    My point being that I wouldn’t follow Urban knowing his character. I’d know he only cared about himself and would throw me under the bus if it saved his skin

  • HumbleDawgHumbleDawg Posts: 7 ✭ Freshman

    Good leaders are not always morally sound individuals. I.e. Hitler

    successful individuals are not always morally sound. I.e. Jeff beezos

    winners aren’t always morally sound.

    there are very few major college football head coaches who aren’t great leaders.

    If and when my son were ever to be recruited to play ball the question I would have to ask myself is, “can I live with this guys moral compass?”

    Urban wouldn’t get a passing grade on that question.

  • Casanova_FlatulenceCasanova_Flatulence Posts: 1,426 ✭✭✭✭✭ Graduate

    You can be a bad person and still be a good leader for a period of time. There are tons of examples throughout history of people having bizarre, self-destructive or deviant behaviors in their private lives, but were able to motivate and lead people to a common purpose or objective. JFK is a prime example. If you know anything about his personal life then you know he was a sexual predator and deviant who cheated on his wife regularly. Same could said about Bill Clinton.

    My former next door neighbor was Uncle and guardian to the Burton brothers, both played for Meyers. From the many stories he's told me about Urban, that man could command a room like like nobody's business. His track record of success speaks to his leadership skills. That said, he's not someone I respect.

  • KaseyKasey Posts: 8,642 mod

    Same could also be said about Nixon (morals) and Trump (sexual predator) so that goes both ways.

    I have no doubt Urban commands a room. But for me character counts

  • BankwalkerBankwalker Posts: 3,436 ✭✭✭✭✭ Graduate

    The premise for the entire thread was silly, but the stuff you list about Mark Richt makes you sound like a Ga Tech fan. “Off the Field” troubles? There were a slew of driving without a license arrests but no major issues of violence toward women, armed robbery, or other felonies. Mediocre assistant hires? Such as? Okay Schottenheimer. He’s not a mediocre football coach. He just didn’t fit the college game but grabbing an OC from the NFL would have been celebrated by you bunch of urnge tards in a big way until it didn’t work out. One year isn’t a sample size to judge.

    As for graduation success rates, the program was performing lackluster under Jim Donnan. 2007 was the first year (cohort class of 2001) that was actually under Mark Richt’s full guidance. The rate was just below 50% and increased every year. The 2006 class graduation rate was 82%, which was for the year 2012 (higher than Clemson, btw). That was also tops in the SEC.

    That number has fallen a bit, but even you should be able to comprehend that comes with the territory when a new coach is hired ; transfers, etc. Clemson has a nice graduation rate over the last 5-7 years but prior to that you guys were below the national avg in the 60 percent range - and not sniffing the Top 10 on the field the way Richt was doing.

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