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Josh Donaldson

2

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    KirbstomperKirbstomper Posts: 1,102 ✭✭✭✭✭ Graduate

    @WCDawg said:

    @donm said:

    @TNDawg71 said:
    I'm definitely impressed they spent on Donaldson, and hope it works out. Just seems like a roll of the dice with $23M that I didn't expect from this group. Hopefully the physical is thorough and comes up clean.

    It will be fun (I hope) to follow him thru the season. I'm glad we got a one year deal for him...if he doesn't work out were clean. If he does, we can trade him or keep him, although 23 mil is a pretty steep price tag. I like that AA isn't afraid to take chances. I'm a little nervous that he seems to favor his former players (Joey Bats, for example). But then, one could argue, he at least knows them quite well and what they can do - or have done. I just hope Johan doesn't fall in the cracks. I think he could be an elite player, hitting close to .300 and 20+ homers per year plus great D. If he only gets spotty at bats, he won't continue to improve.

    I think the offensive upgrade at SS made possible by this move might be greater than the increase at 3B. If Camargo wins the job over Swanson it could mean an extra 30 to 40 runs for the team over a season. Swanson's low OBP is a deal killer from my perspective. Having a guy with a .300 OBP in the lineup is a rally killer.

    I said this earlier, but I feel like all 5 of the infielders will be “starters”. Kind of in the same breath we would say Ben Zobrist was a starter in the cubs, where he would get 5 starts a week at a bunch of positions. Camargos defensive flexibility is pretty well valued in the modern game and AA has said as much. And Donaldson will need plenty of rest, and hopefully this allows them to rest Ozzie freeman and Swanson more often so they’re fresher throughout the season.

    It’s probably a bit too early to give up on dansby right now, but this is really a make or break season for him.

  • Options
    AndersonDawgAndersonDawg Posts: 1,880 ✭✭✭✭✭ Graduate

    I’m optimistic (maybe hopeful is a better word) that Donaldson pans out. But I remember last year the Braves brought in an outfielder (forgot his name) batting sub 200 and his batting average DROPPED while a Brave. I hope I’m wrong but seems to me $23M should get you a sure thing ( if one exists).

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    Steve_ZissouSteve_Zissou Posts: 307 ✭✭✭ Junior

    Camargo is great- dude will take SS duties this year.
    Dansby still has a little trade value. I could see him moved b4 Spring.
    Not sure why ATL media has Markasis on trading block. We would be foolish to let him go. Solid .285 hitter every year

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    KirbstomperKirbstomper Posts: 1,102 ✭✭✭✭✭ Graduate
    edited November 2018

    @Steve_Zissou said:
    Camargo is great- dude will take SS duties this year.
    Dansby still has a little trade value. I could see him moved b4 Spring.
    Not sure why ATL media has Markasis on trading block. We would be foolish to let him go. Solid .285 hitter every year

    Kakes isn’t on the trading block, he is not under contract with the Braves. They still could re sign him if they want, but so could every other team. That being said there’s more to the game than batting average... very likely we try to upgrade the corner outfield spot instead of signing nick to a stopgap 1 year deal.

    And @AndersonDawg 23M is definitely a lot, but that’s baseball these days. We are seeing contracts in the 30-40M per year range now so 23 is more palatable.

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    kelly_bkelly_b Posts: 1,464 ✭✭✭✭✭ Graduate

    @Steve_Zissou said:
    Camargo is great- dude will take SS duties this year.
    Dansby still has a little trade value. I could see him moved b4 Spring.
    Not sure why ATL media has Markasis on trading block. We would be foolish to let him go. Solid .285 hitter every year

    I like Nick, too, but he played well above expectations last year. If they don't move him now (and let's face it, he's in the twilight of his career) they won't get max value for him, so it makes sense imo.

  • Options
    TNDawg71TNDawg71 Posts: 2,219 ✭✭✭✭✭ Graduate

    @kelly_b said:

    @Steve_Zissou said:
    Camargo is great- dude will take SS duties this year.
    Dansby still has a little trade value. I could see him moved b4 Spring.
    Not sure why ATL media has Markasis on trading block. We would be foolish to let him go. Solid .285 hitter every year

    I like Nick, too, but he played well above expectations last year. If they don't move him now (and let's face it, he's in the twilight of his career) they won't get max value for him, so it makes sense imo.

    Nick is a Free Agent

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    kelly_bkelly_b Posts: 1,464 ✭✭✭✭✭ Graduate

    @TNDawg71 - Ah thx. I wasn't aware of that. For some reason I thought they had him for another year.

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    WCDawgWCDawg Posts: 17,293 ✭✭✭✭✭ Graduate

    @Kirbstomper said:

    @WCDawg said:

    @donm said:

    @TNDawg71 said:
    I'm definitely impressed they spent on Donaldson, and hope it works out. Just seems like a roll of the dice with $23M that I didn't expect from this group. Hopefully the physical is thorough and comes up clean.

    It will be fun (I hope) to follow him thru the season. I'm glad we got a one year deal for him...if he doesn't work out were clean. If he does, we can trade him or keep him, although 23 mil is a pretty steep price tag. I like that AA isn't afraid to take chances. I'm a little nervous that he seems to favor his former players (Joey Bats, for example). But then, one could argue, he at least knows them quite well and what they can do - or have done. I just hope Johan doesn't fall in the cracks. I think he could be an elite player, hitting close to .300 and 20+ homers per year plus great D. If he only gets spotty at bats, he won't continue to improve.

    I think the offensive upgrade at SS made possible by this move might be greater than the increase at 3B. If Camargo wins the job over Swanson it could mean an extra 30 to 40 runs for the team over a season. Swanson's low OBP is a deal killer from my perspective. Having a guy with a .300 OBP in the lineup is a rally killer.

    I said this earlier, but I feel like all 5 of the infielders will be “starters”. Kind of in the same breath we would say Ben Zobrist was a starter in the cubs, where he would get 5 starts a week at a bunch of positions. Camargos defensive flexibility is pretty well valued in the modern game and AA has said as much. And Donaldson will need plenty of rest, and hopefully this allows them to rest Ozzie freeman and Swanson more often so they’re fresher throughout the season.

    It’s probably a bit too early to give up on dansby right now, but this is really a make or break season for him.

    I can't imagine Swanson will get starter's innings if Carmargo works out at SS, unless he improves as a hitter of course.

  • Options
    WCDawgWCDawg Posts: 17,293 ✭✭✭✭✭ Graduate

    @kelly_b said:

    @Steve_Zissou said:
    Camargo is great- dude will take SS duties this year.
    Dansby still has a little trade value. I could see him moved b4 Spring.
    Not sure why ATL media has Markasis on trading block. We would be foolish to let him go. Solid .285 hitter every year

    I like Nick, too, but he played well above expectations last year. If they don't move him now (and let's face it, he's in the twilight of his career) they won't get max value for him, so it makes sense imo.

    Markakis had a good year, but it wasn't an anomaly, he's never had a really bad year in 13 MLB seasons.
    In 2018 his OBP was .366, his career average is .358.
    His BA in 2018 was .297, his career average is .288.
    He also played all 162 games in 2018. I think he'd be low risk over a 3 season contract.

  • Options
    kelly_bkelly_b Posts: 1,464 ✭✭✭✭✭ Graduate

    @WCDawg said:

    @kelly_b said:

    @Steve_Zissou said:
    Camargo is great- dude will take SS duties this year.
    Dansby still has a little trade value. I could see him moved b4 Spring.
    Not sure why ATL media has Markasis on trading block. We would be foolish to let him go. Solid .285 hitter every year

    I like Nick, too, but he played well above expectations last year. If they don't move him now (and let's face it, he's in the twilight of his career) they won't get max value for him, so it makes sense imo.

    Markakis had a good year, but it wasn't an anomaly, he's never had a really bad year in 13 MLB seasons.
    In 2018 his OBP was .366, his career average is .358.
    His BA in 2018 was .297, his career average is .288.
    He also played all 162 games in 2018. I think he'd be low risk over a 3 season contract.

    No, you're right, but nobody really expected him to perform as well as he did. And he was great. Plus, I was under the misapprehension that we had him for another year, but as @TNDawg71 pointed out to me, he's a free agent. It all depends. Personally, I'd like to see them invest the lion's share of what's left to spend on the pen and maybe a front-end guy to fill the hole Teheran represents. As much as I like Julio, he's too unpredictable. I don't know. Do we have any prospects in the OF who could take Nick's place or do you think they should sign him?

  • Options
    KirbstomperKirbstomper Posts: 1,102 ✭✭✭✭✭ Graduate

    @WCDawg said:

    @kelly_b said:

    @Steve_Zissou said:
    Camargo is great- dude will take SS duties this year.
    Dansby still has a little trade value. I could see him moved b4 Spring.
    Not sure why ATL media has Markasis on trading block. We would be foolish to let him go. Solid .285 hitter every year

    I like Nick, too, but he played well above expectations last year. If they don't move him now (and let's face it, he's in the twilight of his career) they won't get max value for him, so it makes sense imo.

    Markakis had a good year, but it wasn't an anomaly, he's never had a really bad year in 13 MLB seasons.
    In 2018 his OBP was .366, his career average is .358.
    His BA in 2018 was .297, his career average is .288.
    He also played all 162 games in 2018. I think he'd be low risk over a 3 season contract.

    We have talked about this before, so you know I adamantly disagree. I say that he was horrible in 2016 and 2017 and is 35 years old. Don’t need to rehash all that though.

    I hope they go after a 3-4 win player with some years of control in that spot via trade. They’ve got plenty of prospects to swing some deals

  • Options
    WCDawgWCDawg Posts: 17,293 ✭✭✭✭✭ Graduate

    @kelly_b said:

    @WCDawg said:

    @kelly_b said:

    @Steve_Zissou said:
    Camargo is great- dude will take SS duties this year.
    Dansby still has a little trade value. I could see him moved b4 Spring.
    Not sure why ATL media has Markasis on trading block. We would be foolish to let him go. Solid .285 hitter every year

    I like Nick, too, but he played well above expectations last year. If they don't move him now (and let's face it, he's in the twilight of his career) they won't get max value for him, so it makes sense imo.

    Markakis had a good year, but it wasn't an anomaly, he's never had a really bad year in 13 MLB seasons.
    In 2018 his OBP was .366, his career average is .358.
    His BA in 2018 was .297, his career average is .288.
    He also played all 162 games in 2018. I think he'd be low risk over a 3 season contract.

    No, you're right, but nobody really expected him to perform as well as he did. And he was great. Plus, I was under the misapprehension that we had him for another year, but as @TNDawg71 pointed out to me, he's a free agent. It all depends. Personally, I'd like to see them invest the lion's share of what's left to spend on the pen and maybe a front-end guy to fill the hole Teheran represents. As much as I like Julio, he's too unpredictable. I don't know. Do we have any prospects in the OF who could take Nick's place or do you think they should sign him?

    It depends on how management feels about options in RF if Nick isn't brought back. I'd hate to add offense in one spot just to lose it in another area. NM has a very solid built, no injury concerns and a very mechanically sound nd patient approach to hitting.

  • Options
    WCDawgWCDawg Posts: 17,293 ✭✭✭✭✭ Graduate
    edited November 2018

    @Kirbstomper said:

    @WCDawg said:

    @kelly_b said:

    @Steve_Zissou said:
    Camargo is great- dude will take SS duties this year.
    Dansby still has a little trade value. I could see him moved b4 Spring.
    Not sure why ATL media has Markasis on trading block. We would be foolish to let him go. Solid .285 hitter every year

    I like Nick, too, but he played well above expectations last year. If they don't move him now (and let's face it, he's in the twilight of his career) they won't get max value for him, so it makes sense imo.

    Markakis had a good year, but it wasn't an anomaly, he's never had a really bad year in 13 MLB seasons.
    In 2018 his OBP was .366, his career average is .358.
    His BA in 2018 was .297, his career average is .288.
    He also played all 162 games in 2018. I think he'd be low risk over a 3 season contract.

    We have talked about this before, so you know I adamantly disagree. I say that he was horrible in 2016 and 2017 and is 35 years old. Don’t need to rehash all that though.

    I hope they go after a 3-4 win player with some years of control in that spot via trade. They’ve got plenty of prospects to swing some deals

    Here is how I view it.
    In NM's 4 seasons as a Brave he's been 1st in MLB among RFs in doubles twice and 2nd the other 2 years. His OBP has averaged 6th among RFs, but since those top 5 spots have been divided among more than 5 players, he's likely around 3rd overall. He has averaged playing 148 games over the past 8 seasons and he's committed just 10 errors over those 1184 games. He gets on base, he hits doubles, he doesn't commit errors and he's on the field almost every game, that is good net value.

  • Options
    TNDawg71TNDawg71 Posts: 2,219 ✭✭✭✭✭ Graduate

    @WCDawg said:

    @kelly_b said:

    @WCDawg said:

    @kelly_b said:

    @Steve_Zissou said:
    Camargo is great- dude will take SS duties this year.
    Dansby still has a little trade value. I could see him moved b4 Spring.
    Not sure why ATL media has Markasis on trading block. We would be foolish to let him go. Solid .285 hitter every year

    I like Nick, too, but he played well above expectations last year. If they don't move him now (and let's face it, he's in the twilight of his career) they won't get max value for him, so it makes sense imo.

    Markakis had a good year, but it wasn't an anomaly, he's never had a really bad year in 13 MLB seasons.
    In 2018 his OBP was .366, his career average is .358.
    His BA in 2018 was .297, his career average is .288.
    He also played all 162 games in 2018. I think he'd be low risk over a 3 season contract.

    No, you're right, but nobody really expected him to perform as well as he did. And he was great. Plus, I was under the misapprehension that we had him for another year, but as @TNDawg71 pointed out to me, he's a free agent. It all depends. Personally, I'd like to see them invest the lion's share of what's left to spend on the pen and maybe a front-end guy to fill the hole Teheran represents. As much as I like Julio, he's too unpredictable. I don't know. Do we have any prospects in the OF who could take Nick's place or do you think they should sign him?

    It depends on how management feels about options in RF if Nick isn't brought back. I'd hate to add offense in one spot just to lose it in another area. NM has a very solid built, no injury concerns and a very mechanically sound nd patient approach to hitting.

    I'm good with bringing him back, but in needs to be a 1-2 year or an inexpensive deal. Age always wins out. If there is a younger/cheaper option I'd prefer that.

  • Options
    kelly_bkelly_b Posts: 1,464 ✭✭✭✭✭ Graduate

    @TNDawg71 said:

    @WCDawg said:

    @kelly_b said:

    @WCDawg said:

    @kelly_b said:

    @Steve_Zissou said:
    Camargo is great- dude will take SS duties this year.
    Dansby still has a little trade value. I could see him moved b4 Spring.
    Not sure why ATL media has Markasis on trading block. We would be foolish to let him go. Solid .285 hitter every year

    I like Nick, too, but he played well above expectations last year. If they don't move him now (and let's face it, he's in the twilight of his career) they won't get max value for him, so it makes sense imo.

    Markakis had a good year, but it wasn't an anomaly, he's never had a really bad year in 13 MLB seasons.
    In 2018 his OBP was .366, his career average is .358.
    His BA in 2018 was .297, his career average is .288.
    He also played all 162 games in 2018. I think he'd be low risk over a 3 season contract.

    No, you're right, but nobody really expected him to perform as well as he did. And he was great. Plus, I was under the misapprehension that we had him for another year, but as @TNDawg71 pointed out to me, he's a free agent. It all depends. Personally, I'd like to see them invest the lion's share of what's left to spend on the pen and maybe a front-end guy to fill the hole Teheran represents. As much as I like Julio, he's too unpredictable. I don't know. Do we have any prospects in the OF who could take Nick's place or do you think they should sign him?

    It depends on how management feels about options in RF if Nick isn't brought back. I'd hate to add offense in one spot just to lose it in another area. NM has a very solid built, no injury concerns and a very mechanically sound nd patient approach to hitting.

    I'm good with bringing him back, but in needs to be a 1-2 year or an inexpensive deal. Age always wins out. If there is a younger/cheaper option I'd prefer that.

    That's the gamble. His age. When is that drop-off coming? @WCDawg put up solid stats and he's right. I certainly won't grumble if he returns. I really loved watching him play this last season, but I will understand if the Braves pass. I'd like to be the proverbial fly on the wall and hear those conversations.

  • Options
    WCDawgWCDawg Posts: 17,293 ✭✭✭✭✭ Graduate

    @TNDawg71 said:

    @WCDawg said:

    @kelly_b said:

    @WCDawg said:

    @kelly_b said:

    @Steve_Zissou said:
    Camargo is great- dude will take SS duties this year.
    Dansby still has a little trade value. I could see him moved b4 Spring.
    Not sure why ATL media has Markasis on trading block. We would be foolish to let him go. Solid .285 hitter every year

    I like Nick, too, but he played well above expectations last year. If they don't move him now (and let's face it, he's in the twilight of his career) they won't get max value for him, so it makes sense imo.

    Markakis had a good year, but it wasn't an anomaly, he's never had a really bad year in 13 MLB seasons.
    In 2018 his OBP was .366, his career average is .358.
    His BA in 2018 was .297, his career average is .288.
    He also played all 162 games in 2018. I think he'd be low risk over a 3 season contract.

    No, you're right, but nobody really expected him to perform as well as he did. And he was great. Plus, I was under the misapprehension that we had him for another year, but as @TNDawg71 pointed out to me, he's a free agent. It all depends. Personally, I'd like to see them invest the lion's share of what's left to spend on the pen and maybe a front-end guy to fill the hole Teheran represents. As much as I like Julio, he's too unpredictable. I don't know. Do we have any prospects in the OF who could take Nick's place or do you think they should sign him?

    It depends on how management feels about options in RF if Nick isn't brought back. I'd hate to add offense in one spot just to lose it in another area. NM has a very solid built, no injury concerns and a very mechanically sound nd patient approach to hitting.

    I'm good with bringing him back, but in needs to be a 1-2 year or an inexpensive deal. Age always wins out. If there is a younger/cheaper option I'd prefer that.

    I'd prefer a 2 year deal, at the right price of course. My question is always, is he likely better than who we'd end up with if we go another way.

  • Options
    kelly_bkelly_b Posts: 1,464 ✭✭✭✭✭ Graduate

    I'd prefer a 2 year deal, at the right price of course. My question is always, is he likely better than who we'd end up with if we go another way.

    Yeah, I'm trying to think about who's out there but I haven't been keeping up on a daily basis like I will come spring training. So, I don't know who that candidate might be. I'm so consumed with UGA right now...which is cool because it's an ideal salve for the Falcons which makes me feel dreadful for even alluding to them.

  • Options
    PTDawgPTDawg Posts: 2,169 ✭✭✭✭✭ Graduate

    I'm concerned that 2018 may have been a bit of an anomaly for him at this point in his career. I don't have the stats in front of me but he was an all-star level performer the first 6-8 weeks. After that he was a replacement level player the rest of the way.

  • Options
    WCDawgWCDawg Posts: 17,293 ✭✭✭✭✭ Graduate

    @kelly_b said:

    I'd prefer a 2 year deal, at the right price of course. My question is always, is he likely better than who we'd end up with if we go another way.

    Yeah, I'm trying to think about who's out there but I haven't been keeping up on a daily basis like I will come spring training. So, I don't know who that candidate might be. I'm so consumed with UGA right now...which is cool because it's an ideal salve for the Falcons which makes me feel dreadful for even alluding to them.

    Who are these Foul-cons you allude to ?
    I might do some quick research on potential free agent and trade bait RFs tonight.

  • Options
    KirbstomperKirbstomper Posts: 1,102 ✭✭✭✭✭ Graduate

    @kelly_b said:

    I'd prefer a 2 year deal, at the right price of course. My question is always, is he likely better than who we'd end up with if we go another way.

    Yeah, I'm trying to think about who's out there but I haven't been keeping up on a daily basis like I will come spring training. So, I don't know who that candidate might be. I'm so consumed with UGA right now...which is cool because it's an ideal salve for the Falcons which makes me feel dreadful for even alluding to them.

    Brantley and pollack are two of the top free agents still out there that have upside. As usual both are on the tail end of their careers and have injury risks, but both have shown to be good players when healthy. They could also try and target someone else in a trade, though I haven’t heard any names associated with them.

    If they re sign Markakis it would probably be a stopgap for a year or just for outfield depth. Publicly available Projection systems estimate him to be about 1.1 WAR in 2019 which is below average to bad. Teams will have their own systems, but the projections will probably be pretty similar.

    And while Nick was pretty good in 2018 with 2.6 WAR, he was below average in 2016 at 1.2 WAR and bad in 2017, at 0.5 WAR despite decent surface level stats. If you buy into him replicating 2018 again he would be a pretty good option, but contending teams can’t afford to give consistent starts to 2017 Nick.

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