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- 3/17/19 UPDATE -- We've updated the permissions for our "Football" and "Commit to the G" recruiting message boards. We aim to be the best free board out there and that has not changed. We do now ask that all of you good people register as a member of our forum in order to see the sugar that is falling from our skies, so to speak.
COVID-19 Check-in
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Comments
I'm an insensitive idiot. I realize that. And I know many Americans are suffering because they have lost loved ones or have loved ones struggling with this virus......I pray every single day for the health of our country and especially those in the New York area.
But come May 1st......let's open it back up.....schools, restaurants, universities, theatres, sports etc....
Continue practicing social distancing.....but open it up.
Encourage those that want to home school to do so....
Encourage those that want to take on line college to do so.
For those at high risk or uncomfortable with being out.....encourage them to stay in if they choose. Even provide assistance if needed. (Although that will be greatly taken advantage of)
Athletes that don't want to participate in sports shouldn't have to.
But those that want to take the risk of going on living and accept the consequences should be able to do so.
If you want to see a ball game.....go see it. If you want to see a movie .....go watch it.
Unfortunately, I realize that this could cost millions of lives.....probably 1-2% of our population.....which is a huge number.....but the alternative is starting to look worse.
And the worst part is.....this virus is being used politically.....from both conservatives and liberals. What a perfect storm being in an election year.
As a conservative I know why Trump and other Republicans want to open things up. Save the economy and save their political future. The worse the economy the less likely they are to holding office.
It's becoming obvious why some Democrats don't want to open it up.....the worse the economy the better chance they have at winning....and they can push through mail in voting which is extremely fraudulent.
Republicans and Democrats are both guilty. Obviously lives matter to both parties......and I know that Trump, McConnell, Pelosi, Schumer and others don't want to see Americans die. Regardless of their affiliations....they are human.
But they also know that moving to fast or moving to slow will greatly affect politics for the next foreseeable future.
And that sucks.
Let Americans decide for themselves what risks they choose to live with.
Go Dawgs
Out here in California, I have heard lots of speculation about why California hasn't had as many cases. I have seen any concrete information. On one hand, California was the first state to implement shelter-in-place. On the other hand, because we had the first US case, thus the timeline from when California got its first case to when it implemented sheltering in place was actually a lot longer than for most other states including New York that has gotten hit so hard. Also, everyone I know, including myself and including someone who went to the ER with respitory problems could not get tested. For every country that has been successful keeping Covid19 low, testing has been a major part of the strategy and California had virtually no testing except on the most at risk patients.
So, if we had a long-time frame from first case to sheltering in place and we have had poor testing, why does California have low numbers?
The three most common things I have heard for why our numbers are low are:
So at the end of the day, no one knows. The most likely is that some combination of #2 and #3 preventing California from reaching a tipping point but it is only likely because as of now we don't have a better answer. I wonder if we will ever know, I'm definitely curious about why.
Do you realize the order of magnitude of deaths you’re talking about would be larger than world war 2? When we open it up I hope we don’t see anything near those types of numbers.
Second, if it spreads rapidly throughout the country the more susceptible won’t be protected. That many deaths will also cripple the economy. Not to mention the pressure it’s already put on hospitals within such a limited timeframe.
Politics aside, a recession/depression is almost a certainty. I know people are impatient but this is the new reality for a while.
Again, let's keep politics out of this discussion. As tough as it may be, there can be some good discussion brought here on the subject without interjecting politics into it. Warnings will be issued to those that continue and disregard what has been stated numerous times in this thread.
Thanks!!
The reason Democrats, Public Health experts and generally educated people globally don’t think an open the economy all at once is intelligent is because losing 1-2% worlds population is 100x worse than a quarter of economic slowdown.
US healthcare system cannot handle the cases it currently has. You are suggesting immensely increasing the stress on this system
It has nothing to do w Donald Trumps re-election. Globally, No one cares about him or listens to his nonsense outside of the hopeless lost-causes.
IMO- they should re-open the economy On 5/1 just for trump rallies. Decrease the surplus population
Doing well still over in Germany. Weather is amazing right now but can't travel which kinda takes the fun out of living overseas. Its mandatory to wear face masks on base now so that's taken some getting used to. I'm not a big fan of it. Makes me feel like i'm playing red dead redemption and i'm about to get robbed. Still no word on when restrictions will be lifted.
My social distancing a few minutes ago.
What happened in Michigan yesterday will continue. Some will protest lockdowns, some will protest hunger, some will protest poverty.
Hope that doesn't get nasty in big cities.
There are several barometers for this situation - sports is a good one.
I think I may know another - Disney World...
Give me your guess to when it opens up (the actual parks) for business...
28 states offer mail-in ballots and 5 conduct their elections entirely through mail. Not only that, but the president himself voted by mail in Florida’s primary election last month and in the 2018 midterms. If it is in fact “extremely fraudulent”, you’d think he wouldn’t do it himself in addition to nearly half the country. If things are still hot by November, mail-in is the way to go in order to protect the population. Don’t even get me started on the Diebold voting machines used in GA, now that’s extremely fraudulent.
Yes....I realize the casualties. And acknowledged it in my post. It's an awful and disturbing consequence.
How confident are you that shelter in place won't result in worse consequences?
And it seems that some are throwing out that the obvious recession/depression is just gonna happen.....we'll just have to fight through it....I just don't think it's that simple.
I'm not suggesting in any way that this virus isn't awful. It's an evil SOB. I'm not downplaying the importance of social distancing....obviously things have to change.....some forever.
And I understand your fear and why you feel the way you do. And I'm not suggesting you are wrong.
But I'll argue that those that think we should be cautious, continue to shelter in place and save as many lives as possible....regardless of the economic ramifications...may be overlooking just how dangerous that optuon could be as well.
The problem with making any decision in this climate is we have no idea what the real consequences are. Some models predict 40,000 US deaths while others predict 2,000,000. If I were making the call, I might go two different directions based on which numbers I thought were most accurate.
Another unknown is the actual economic detriment a sustained shelter-in-place will have, how soon we can recover from it, etc. How many jobs will be permanently destroyed? What psychological affects will follow? And while we really don't know any specific answers, the generalities are pretty clear. Everyone will be affected to some extent. I consider myself fortunate to have a job that is very stable. I could ignore this side of the equation as I will likely be affected less than most. But that would be unrealistic.
All this to say, the only sure things are that some people will die from COVID 19 and everyone will be affected by the economy. I don't know that I can firmly make a decision on that, but I think it is pretty obvious which way I'm leaning on the issue.
BTW, I couldn't care less about the political ramifications. I've been blissfully excusing myself from political discord for years now.
With the price of admission at Disney World/Land, they ought to throw in a hazmat suit for everybody and get this thing going.
To be clear, I’m certain of very little. Much more intelligent people than me are also certain of very little. I feel as though this won’t pass soon, and I’d be happy to be wrong.
My comment on recession/depression comes down to 2 awful options; first is that shelter in place stops or slows business to a halt and there’s just an extension of the unemployment we’re already seeing. Second is that we open things up a bit more and subject more people to the virus, which will cause more hospital issues and most likely infect more people on the front lines - first responders, people in charge of shipping and distributing food. What happens if your local office has a case of covid? Are we going to have rolling outages of work as this hits every corner of the country? The psychological impact is also going to take a toll where a lot of people won’t go to restaurants, theaters, museums, get on planes - those businesses are going to get crushed. To me, it seems a recession is inevitable because we are sandwiched between the proverbial rock and a hard place. I doubt opening things up avoids a recession, and shelter in place definitely won’t work economically for long. Again, no good options and we’re all in this together.
The opening up of the economy in the manner that you suggest has untold consequences. The infection rate of healthcare workers indicates just how difficult it is to prevent infection even with masks and gloves. The post I made earlier to get to the number of deaths at 2.6 million assumed that the current apparent mortality rate of 8% of "Cases" (not infections) continues. If you start opening up sporting events, movies, concerts etc. it is impossible to socially distance. This will lead to the health system being brought to it's knees and the rate could easily doubled. Of those currently hospitalized 80% recover and are discharged. As the rate of spread increases many of the "80%" won't even get admitted to get the life-saving care that they need due to lack of space and equipment. Further response times to "normal" 911 calls will be extended and many more such incidents be it GSW, road accidents, heart attacks etc. will result in avoidable deaths. The misconception is that only the old will die. Most of the indirect deaths impact all genders and ages alike.
The issue I have with "Let Americans decide for themselves what risks they choose to live with." is that the risks will be felt by those that choose not to take them as well. For example, a restaurant worker goes to a sporting event and contracts the virus, goes to work the next day and infects customers and coworkers who then die. The same would apply to any worker that has contact with customers.
The economy can only recover when this pandemic is under better control than it is today. We are after all a consumer driven economy (which has been increasingly debt driven) and politicians and CEOs can decide to open all they want but if the consumer thinks that it is even less safe to go to the restaurant, store or whatever, the business will not succeed nor survive.
Good points. Difficult all around